r/facepalm Pondering the fate of humanity Aug 07 '22 Wholesome 2 Helpful 2 Silver 3

Do people.. actually think like this?! 🇲​🇮​🇸​🇨​

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u/memelord58 Aug 07 '22 Silver Gold Helpful

As an atheist i do indulge in my darkest desires

Premarital sex...

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u/iworkthepole Aug 07 '22 Silver All-Seeing Upvote

And cheesecake

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u/memelord58 Aug 07 '22 Wholesome

Mostly cheesecake

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u/Maleficent_Ad1972 Aug 07 '22 Helpful

Only cheesecake. :(

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u/BoJackB26354 Aug 07 '22

Premarital cheesecake.

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u/Stian5667 Aug 08 '22

Premarital hand holding? 🥺👉👈

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u/AlphaGamer_Dubz Aug 08 '22

Woah man I'm an atheist and that's too far

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u/mmmkay938 Aug 08 '22

Premarital sex with cheesecake

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u/KingCrandall Aug 08 '22

Premarital chessesex

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u/ye1l Aug 08 '22

Why is there a hole in my cheesecake?

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u/MistaHatesNumberFour Aug 08 '22

Premarital eye contact

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u/Shadow87907 Aug 08 '22

Too much man!! We'll have to burn you at the stake if you don't stop

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u/ConnectConcern6 Aug 08 '22

premarital existence in the same room

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u/MzMag00 Aug 08 '22

I wanna hold your haaaaaand 🎵🎵

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u/sleeve612 Aug 08 '22

You know who has hands? The devil! You know what he uses them for? Holding things!

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u/MzMag00 Aug 08 '22

That's right. Especially hands. Premarital hands.

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u/bigfloppydonkeydng Aug 08 '22

I don't have a hand

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u/MzMag00 Aug 08 '22

Look here. I'm trying to serenade you with The Beatles and you're just not even trying to let me woo you.

Rude.

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u/Dabber_Danny Aug 08 '22

We're atheists, not monsters

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u/rascible Aug 08 '22

Next they'll be dancing

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u/Excellent_Salary_767 Aug 08 '22

Whoa. There's no need for that kind of talk 😅

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u/asttocatbunny Aug 08 '22

Im married middle aged. Lots more cheesecake than postmarital sex. Lol!

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u/Maleficent_Tie4767 Aug 07 '22

How about sex and cheesecake at the same time? Live the dream....

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u/The_I_in_IT Aug 07 '22

Yeah, but then you’ve got twice the mess and nothing to look forward to after sex.

You see-first the premarital sex, THEN the cheesecake. It’s really a win/win.

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u/Maleficent_Tie4767 Aug 07 '22

Who said I don't keep TWO cheesecakes around for just such an event! lol

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u/CheiroAMilho Aug 08 '22

It's not premarital if you never get married

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u/moizuess Aug 08 '22

I'll occasionally covet thy neighbours wife, she thicc.

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u/revtim Aug 07 '22 Gold Helpful

"The question I get asked by religious people all the time is, without God, what’s to stop me from raping all I want? And my answer is: I do rape all I want. And the amount I want is zero. And I do murder all I want, and the amount I want is zero. The fact that these people think that if they didn’t have this person watching over them that they would go on killing, raping rampages is the most self-damning thing I can imagine." -- Penn Jillette

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u/No_Introduction5665 Aug 07 '22

I wonder what their god would do if they raped. Government would send them to jail. Their god would let everything go with a few Hail Mary’s

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u/revtim Aug 07 '22

The Bible says a rapist has to pay a fine and marry the victim. So, love a girl but she doesn't love you? Just rape her! And congratulations on your nuptials.

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u/DeltaDarthVicious Aug 07 '22

That's why we should be thankful most christians have never read the bible

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u/RedditVince Aug 07 '22

And the ones that have, pick and choose those they misremember to their own thinking.

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u/JaxxisR Aug 07 '22

Myq Kaplan had a good line about that in one of his specials.

"Honor your father and mother." Love it. Cherish it. "Don't eat pork." That's stupid. I like bacon.

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u/Zaynara Aug 07 '22 Silver

maybe we do need religion for these fucking whackos, i dunno, just nuts the way these religious whackadoos think, if the huge number of people that are religious were shown concrete evidence that god wasn't real, do you think a large number of them would instantly switch to rampant rape, murder, and anything else they can get away with?

... frankly this may explain the religious right in the US, they've perverted their own view of their own religion that they think its justifiable to be as shitastic as they are

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u/YungMister95 Aug 08 '22

Today a woman on my Facebook feed unironically said she knows dragons are real and exist somewhere in this world because the Bible says so. 1200 likes. These people are so divorced from reality; who knows what kind of morality you’re operating under when your worldview is so fucking insane.

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u/adiking27 Aug 08 '22

Fun fact: dragons was actually the way Romans described dinosaurs when they found their fossils.

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u/PaladinWiz Aug 08 '22

But they do exist, haven’t you heard of the Komodo Dragon? /s

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u/SpiritOne Aug 07 '22 edited Aug 08 '22 Silver Helpful Wholesome All-Seeing Upvote Take My Energy

There’s an episode of Penn & Teller Bullshit that answers this perfectly.

I do rape and murder all I want. The amount I want is fucking ZERO. Why? Because I don’t need the threat of eternal damnation from a loving god to understand that’s fucking horrible, and I don’t want to fucking do it.

Edit: this edit to explain to all of you asking by whom do I measure my morals, and why do I know that it’s wrong, and still somehow try to attribute it to some magical sky daddy.

Do YOU want to be raped and/or murdered?? No? Why not? Because god says that’s morally wrong? No because you don’t want that to happen to you because it would be terrible.

Therefore we, as a collective society have decided, you know what, I don’t want that to happen to ME, therefore I don’t want to that to other people. And that makes society better. Welcome to civilization.

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u/SnausageFest Aug 07 '22 Helpful All-Seeing Upvote Table Slap

It's seriously disturbing that fucking kids is on this list.

They're essentially announcing they want to rape a child and sky daddy is the only reason they don't. They think we're all secret pedos.

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u/nana_banana2 Aug 07 '22

It's even more disturbing when you learn about the amount of child rape committed by the Catholic church.

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u/Utahmule Aug 07 '22

It's not only the Catholic Church. If we had information, I bet per capita they would be on the low end when compared with the other churches.

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u/SnooMaps9864 Aug 07 '22

*cough cough Mormons

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u/Lost_Ohio Aug 07 '22

Or cults like, "The Children of God." It's a cult, but still. It now goes by "The Family International." For those of you wondering it's the same cult Joaquin Phoenix's family belonged too. It's on of the main reasons why River was so bad in drugs. He was running from the pain.

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u/relltree Aug 07 '22

They're all cults. More successful cults are called religions.

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u/madoneami Aug 07 '22

Just to add because it is relevant…..there is a saying that

“the only difference between cult’s and religions is that the religions leader is dead”

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u/badgamesghost Aug 07 '22 edited Aug 07 '22

Didn’t the leader of the beach davidians marry a 14 year old

Edit:branch

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u/gobbo Aug 07 '22 Helpful Golden Snoo Award

Yeah you are thinking of the Branch Dravidians.

The Beach Davidians hung up their surfboards when David got arrested for pareidolia.

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u/RedactedPilot Aug 07 '22

There were 300,000 child marriages in the US between 2016 and 2019. It’s legal in 44 states. It’s so tucked up it’s beyond words. Nineteen of those states have no legal minimum age for the “bride.”

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u/Ffdmatt Aug 08 '22

Yeah but trans people are getting rights in places like New York, we gotta protect the kids from that instead! /s

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u/Old-Departure-2698 Aug 07 '22

Apparently it's really bad in many of the Amish groups as well.

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u/Snushine Aug 07 '22

I'm a therapist and these survivors are my clientele. Due to confidentiality, all I can say is "you are not wrong."

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u/Cerberus_Aus Aug 07 '22

I don’t know how you can do that job, but honest question, do you clients ever find some peace?

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u/Snushine Aug 08 '22

It depends on what you call 'peace.' Do they come to a place of understanding and grow past the knee-jerk trauma responses? Yes, they can get there. Do they get the justice they deserve? No. Not often enough.

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u/d-a-v-e- Aug 07 '22

In the Netherlands, the extensive Deetman research found out that orphans had the highest change of being molested if they were put in the care of catholic institutions. I think it was 3 fold that of other institutions, but I forgot the exact number.

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u/makebbq_notwar Aug 07 '22

The Southern Baptist Convention is currently dealing with its own sex abuse cover up. Since the individual churches are technically independent, it’s made the cover up much easier and harder to fix.

https://www.npr.org/2022/06/02/1102621352/how-the-southern-baptist-convention-covered-up-its-widespread-sexual-abuse-scand

Now a lot of former Baptist ministers have rebranded into non-denominational churches with even less over site than the least we could do effort of most mainline denominations.

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u/nana_banana2 Aug 07 '22

It's not only the Catholic Church.

Oh I totally agree. Somehow I thought the OP was about Christianity, but I checked and it isn't

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u/CheshireMoe Aug 07 '22

Other Churches have had their own pedo protection scandals. Not sure if Baptist was a recent one, but Jewish groups have too.

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u/mitsumoi1092 Aug 07 '22

Just saw a post yesterday about the LDS/Mormon church putting out talks in response to the massive sexual abuse within their ranks and saying more or less, to talk about it with their church leaders and understand how in some way, it's partially their fault. While not all religious peopole are bad, most bad people are religious, and that is why I often believe myself to be a better person than pretty much anyone who announces they are religious.

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u/the-truthseeker Aug 07 '22

You mean the system to stop women from getting political land and power that was done many hundreds almost a thousand plus years ago that do not allow priests to in any way have wedding or intimacy possibly causes people to use others who are too powerless to resist rape over hundreds of years?! I'm shocked I tell you, shocked!

The next thing you'll tell me is that people with sex impulse problems are trying to claim they'll be celibate to "stop" this, so they become a priest in the Catholic Church before they act on those horrible horrible urges that they have in the first place?! And it always works?!

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u/nana_banana2 Aug 07 '22

do not allow priests to in any way have wedding or intimacy possibly causes people to use others

Of course not. Celibacy always works, this is why countries that tell teenagers to abstain instead of using contraception, end up with zero teenage pregnancies!

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u/the-truthseeker Aug 07 '22

Praise be Sky Dad that's a relief!

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u/draconiandevil09 Aug 07 '22

The LDS saw what the catholic church was doing, looked then square in the eyes and loudly declared "HOLD MY NON-ALCOHOLIC BEER AND WATCH THIS SHIT".

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u/TheRealLordEnoch Aug 07 '22

If you need to fear divine punishment to choose to not go out and, idk, run over twelve children, you're not a good fucking person.

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u/Wise-Profile4256 Aug 07 '22

likewise, if you do good for a window seat in heaven, fuck right off. either do good for goodness sake or eat a bag of dicks.

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u/Environmental_Top948 Aug 07 '22

Am I allowed to do both? Grilled dicks are delicious.

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u/370zDeepfreeze Aug 07 '22

Lol "grilled dicks"

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u/joe_ruins_things Aug 07 '22

I was walking home from church with the church manager. When two kids walked by us, one was a girl between 10 -12 and was wearing a swim outfit (swimming nearby). I was mid sentence when this Mfer elbows me and says " if we weren't men of God, amirite". Made me sick to my stomach.

I reported him to the pastor and the pastor said: "we all have our struggles, we've all been there, 'he without sin cast the first stone'".

Flipped them all off, havent been back to a church since.

I think its better for them to keep themselves under control by whatever "god" they pray to...than to lose their faith and embrace their Disgusting nature...a nature they believe we all share.

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u/Left_Particular_8004 Aug 07 '22

I hate the “he who is without sin” thing. Like ok, I’m not perfect. I know that. But my sins are things like telling white lies and having consensual premarital sex. There’s a huge difference between “not perfect” and “predator”.

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u/Canaanimal Aug 08 '22

That's the fun part about sins. You have to believe that what you are doing is a sin or sinful for it to be one. As far as I'm concerned, baptized and raised Roman Catholic but grew up to be a follower of Odin, I am without sin. So I'll cast all the stones I want at their hypocritical stance.

Sin is only a sin if you believe it to be sinful.

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u/idkiwilldeletethis Aug 07 '22

It genuinely makes me sick how they cannot fathom the idea that someone doesn't rape or murder people, out of their own morality without needing the threat of going to hell

Like they literally think EVERYONE wants to fuck kids, murder people, etc. And the only reason they don't is because they're afraid of god, it's like the idea of being a good person just for goodness sake is impossible to them

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u/lostinNevermore Aug 07 '22

I thinkthey are all secret pedos. That is why they don't understand that we can be decent humans without the use of threats.

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u/the-truthseeker Aug 07 '22

The next thing you'll tell me is that everybody doesn't rape everybody else in bathrooms and use secret tapping codes for downlow gay sex when I'm in government as a republican.... I mean hypothetically?

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u/lostinNevermore Aug 07 '22

Or denounce abortion while secretly forcing your mistress to go get one when you knock her up?

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u/Obvious_the_Troll Aug 07 '22

I mean, I read that statically 94% of known pedophiles claim to be or identify as Christians. Now the fact the the US is 70% Christians or whatever probably plays a factor, but still.

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u/ATGSunCoach Aug 07 '22

Same thing with the whole argument that being gay is a choice. Like they have to wake up every day and fight the urge to suck dick and fuck kids. fuck them.

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u/HippyHitman Aug 07 '22

I actually think that might be a big part of it.

It makes sense: so many anti-queer people end up being closeted, maybe they do genuinely believe that everyone has homosexual urges but to give in to them is a sin.

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u/[deleted] Aug 07 '22

I knew a guy who was gay but came from a SUPER religious and homophobic protestant family. They convinced him to undergo conversion therapy since (in their minds) gay people aren't allowed into heaven among other things. He is now the most homophobic and far-right person I know. I can't talk to him anymore. He is very terrifying to talk to.

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u/OwtoIwtn Aug 07 '22

Yes, it’s like they have the little angel on one shoulder and the devil on the other shoulder telling them opposing things. So while they have horrible impulses, they are not without a conscience. Believing in god and fear of his wrath helps them keep these impulses at bay. They mistakenly believe that everyone is like them.

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u/Itsme_sd Aug 07 '22

You gotta love the people that post things like "I haven't met an atheist that engages honestly..." is just a way to get us to respond. I can assure you they've met plenty and lost most of the arguments, they just needed a strawman to pull people in. People acting out "dark desires" is simply these weird religious freaks projecting.

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u/JusticiarRebel Aug 07 '22

They ask who provides a moral framework if not some supernatural being, but the answer is pretty simple. We do. Not as individuals, but as a society. We select what is wrong and not wrong mostly by democracy not by individual belief. Get a group of 50 atheists together, between 1-3 of them will think the age of consent should be 14 and the other 47-49 will think they are weird.

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u/fzammetti Aug 07 '22

Clicked on comments explicitly just to post this very quote. It's the best and simplest refutation of what is fundamentally a stupid argument that I've ever seen.

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u/rezzacci Aug 07 '22

On the other hand, you sometimes have religious people with wonderful arguments, like a rabbi saying something akin: "If you see a person drowning, you need to think like an atheist. The atheist won't think that God will help the man drowning; he will just go into the water and save him. In time of need, you need to think as if there is no God to help people, but just you."

However, I fear that those people like in the post would just think: "There's no God? So why on Earth should I wet myself saving someone else?", which is depairing.

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u/fzammetti Aug 07 '22

Never heard that, but yeah, that really is a great argument.

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u/Alarming_Ad8005 Aug 07 '22

Exactly. If you need fear to motivate you to NOT be a bad person, odds are you are a bad person

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u/hdmx539 Aug 07 '22

This is also a tell on whomever came up with this. They're essentially admitting if they didn't have eternal damnation for consequences, they'd be doing this shit.

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u/PerniciousSnitOG Aug 07 '22

I think it's worse; by delegating their Moral responsibility to a mythical skygod, they create a mental space to entertain breaking rules a moral person wouldn't seriously consider, because God will save them!

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u/hdmx539 Aug 07 '22

You literally described the "born again" ideology.

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u/oldbastardbob Aug 07 '22

I don't think it should take existence of a supreme being to understand that which harms others is bad if you want humans to live harmoniously in a civil society.

And we all should understand that we humans have better chances of survival and proliferation if we work together in tribes or groups.

Even more so if you want to thrive and raise the standard of living for all. Therefore cooperation and guidelines to comport that beneficial harmony are a good idea.

Not seeing where an omnipotent mythical god handing down these rules is necessary. Unless, of course, you are too stupid to understand or believe those basic sociological concepts.

And even then, what's the difference between "because the law says so" and "because God says so" to a person who really doesn't understand either in the first place.

But then along comes politics and politicians....

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u/Defense-of-Sanity Aug 07 '22

There is a more formidable way of proposing the challenge, even given your criterion of “living in harmony in civil society” — is there rational basis for not doing something considered immoral when it doesn’t compromise that harmony, or even when it bolsters it?

I’m skeptical of the claim that things considered immoral will always happen to line up with what’s best for society. On the extreme end, it’s very easy to imagine scenarios where someone has to do extremely heinous and evil thing X to save the world, and since X literally saves society from destruction, it’s by definition “good” under that analysis, or at least tolerable.

In the classic novel Crime and Punishment, Raskolnikov is an philosophical atheist who figures society wouldn’t really be disturbed if he just killed an old lady and stole her possessions, and he would make better use of the money. He meticulously reasons and concludes there would be nothing wrong with doing this, and he does do it. He regrets later, though.

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u/InfectedByEli Aug 07 '22

“To be charitable, one may admit that the religious often seem unaware of how insulting their main proposition actually is. Exchange views with a believer even for a short time, and let us make the assumption that this is a mild and decent believer who does not open the bidding by telling you that your unbelief will endanger your soul and condemn you to hell. It will not be long until you are politely asked how you can possibly know right from wrong. Without holy awe, what is to prevent you form resorting to theft, murder, rape, and perjury? It will sometimes be conceded that non-believers have led ethical lives, and it will also be conceded (as it had better be) that many believers have been responsible for terrible crimes. Nonetheless, the working assumption is that we should have no moral compass if we were not somehow in thrall to an unalterable and unchallengeable celestial dictatorship. What a repulsive idea!” ― Christopher Hitchens, The Portable Atheist: Essential Readings for the Nonbeliever

Not sure when Penn & Teller said this but Hitchens released this book in 2007. Don't know if he had previously used this idea in debates though.

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u/BuriedByAnts Aug 07 '22

its called "a conscience". These goddy people apparently don't have one

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u/Flintz08 Aug 07 '22

I have a theory that they do actually have a conscience or an internal monologue.

The "voice in my head" for me is my own voice. But for some reason, very religious people listen to this voice as if it were God's voice.

I asked a few very religious people I know how does "talking with god" works. Apparently it's a mix of meditating and listening to your own inner monologue.

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u/PerniciousSnitOG Aug 07 '22

The "voice in my head" isn't God; it's just a smart-arse version of myself that has the advantage of seeing how things actually turned out.

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u/kmikek Aug 07 '22

I don't care why we are not raping and murdering. I only care about how we are choosing not to do it.

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u/uncle-brucie Aug 07 '22

“Abraham! Go wake up your son! Bring him over here and kill him!”

-God

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u/Emergency_Ad_5935 Aug 07 '22

I went to a Christian college and no joke a LOT of people who are into the Jesus man think this way.

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u/Logical-Recognition3 Aug 07 '22

I know, right? They have no problem announcing that they have absolutely no moral compass. They have only the fear of eternal damnation keeping them in line.

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u/skrilledcheese Aug 07 '22

I was at a barbershop once and a pastor came in, and I guess he was trying to spread the gospel. He asked me what church I go to, I told him I don't. We get into a conversation. I politely explain my point of view.

Towards the end of the conversation, he started getting a bit prickly, I shit you not, this sentence came out of his mouth "If god isn't real, what's to stop me from raping your wife?".

I've never struck a man of god before, but I came pretty close to it that day.

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u/LightningRodofH8 Aug 07 '22

I always go back to asking the same question:

“Who is morally superior; a person that doesn’t harm others because of their own personal empathy or because they fear punishment?”

They can twist in the wind all they want, they’ll never be able to get around their own argument.

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u/Mutual_Slump_ Aug 07 '22

"If the only thing keeping a person decent is the expectation of divine reward then, brother, that person is a piece of shit; and I'd like to get as many of them out in the open as possible."

Rust Cohle, True Detective

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u/Longjumping_Ad_6484 Aug 07 '22

I grew up evangelical and to be perfectly honest, not a lot of empathy/character development is encouraged within that community. It's all about being forgiven to the point that my youth group had a running joke about how "Jesus died for our sins, so we better make it worth his while." (that was mostly within the context of sex, smoking, swearing, drinking, listening to rock music...you know, normal teen stuff)

When I gave my testimony of faith at like 8 years old, I said, "When we believe in Jesus, God forgives us for every bad thing we've ever done or will ever do. We could even kill somebody and we'd still be forgiven." I then went onto say that we still shouldn't kill anyone because it's wrong but there was no concrete reasoning as to "why" it's wrong beyond "thou shalt not kill."

Going beyond that, the argument I was presented against atheism/evolution (you know, because they're the same thing) is that if every piece of life on earth is just a random occurrence, then why not just kill someone when we don't like them? Afterall, that person is just a random smattering of molecules, right??

So to answer the original question, YES people seriously think like that that because THIS is the argument presented against believing anything else.

I went through a bit of an identity crisis in my late 20s because I was no longer part of the community I grew up in, I was figuring out what I wanted to believe, and I'll be honest: I seriously wrestled with the question "well why can't I just cause harm to other people if there's no divine retribution or reward?" What even is the point of anything?

I became a much more loving and empathetic person once I started studying philosophy (and going to therapy) in my 30s. Studying Stoicism has opened my eyes to so many of the philosophical foundations for what the early Christians built off of and I honestly feel like if the Church encouraged some kind of introspection and spiritual development beyond "repent and believe," we'd all be in a better place.

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u/hanabarbarian Aug 08 '22

Sometimes I think all that god fearing energy gets turned into frustrated and repressed rage. Like, when suddenly broached with the question “what if all this fear and worship means nothing” the reaction most have is to lash out and hurt others.

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u/cheesyrack Aug 07 '22

This is good

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u/Rick_Flexington Aug 07 '22 Silver

“My wife is not an 11 year old boy”

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u/meatmechdriver Aug 07 '22

sick burn, that would have been perfect

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u/mcjard Aug 07 '22

"The same thing that your god would condemn you to, except I don't love you... would you care to traverse the valley of the shadow of me mother fucker?"

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u/AdFlashy7269 Aug 07 '22

This definitely sounds better written down

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u/Theyul1us Aug 07 '22

You should have said "What stops me from killing you then?" Being as awful as he was.

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u/RoamingBicycle Aug 07 '22

No, as it would have validated his point

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u/Teto_the_foxsquirrel Aug 07 '22

Wasn't one of the Duck Dynasty guys saying this kind of thing?

Ah I found the quote that started it. Here's Phil Robertson in 2015:

Spoiler mention of rape and murder.

“I’ll make a bet with you,” Robertson said. “Two guys break into an atheist’s home. He has a little atheist wife and two little atheist daughters. Two guys break into his home and tie him up in a chair and gag him. And then they take his two daughters in front of him and rape both of them and then shoot them and they take his wife and then decapitate her head off in front of him. And then they can look at him and say, ‘Isn’t it great that I don’t have to worry about being judged? Isn’t it great that there’s nothing wrong with this? There’s no right or wrong, now is it dude?’”

Robertson kept going: “Then you take a sharp knife and take his manhood and hold it in front of him and say, ‘Wouldn’t it be something if this [sic] was something wrong with this? But you’re the one who says there is no God, there’s no right, there’s no wrong, so we’re just having fun. We’re sick in the head, have a nice day.’”

“If it happened to them,” Robertson continued, “they probably would say, ‘something about this just ain’t right.”

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u/inkiwitch Aug 07 '22

Good lord, this is the most horrifying hypothetical I have ever seen.

The fact that you can tell he is smug as fuck while saying such graphic, fucked up nightmares makes it so much more unsettling.

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u/ancient_days Aug 07 '22

He really got off on the details, didn't he?

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u/Strongstyleguy Aug 07 '22

Never liked that dude. Pissed me off that he thought black people pre civil rights movement smiling at white people meant they were happier back then

But to address what you quoted, I'm basically agnostic so I believe in...something.

But regardless of what happens at the end of my life, I've never used it as my reasoning for right or wrong.

Heaven and Hell? Cool, I guess, I did my best not to hurt anyone and my soul lives on.

Non existence? A bit of a letdown, but hopefully I did more good in the world than bad and the threat of not iving on as a ghost didn't affect that

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u/nachtkaese Aug 07 '22

Fucking YIKES.

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u/unicyclecopilot Aug 07 '22

And his assailants if being Christian would just then ask for forgiveness from their God and presto sins cleared away and heaven doors open.

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u/meatmechdriver Aug 07 '22

He’s so close to getting the point but too fucked in the head to understand it. That is messed up. The fact that he so clearly fantasizes about it is messed up. And we don’t need an imaginary man in the sky to know it’s messed up.

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u/Necrocornicus Aug 07 '22

To be honest, thank god they DO have religion. Just wish they picked the good parts like “help they neighbor” and not the bad parts like “murder the infidels”.

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u/wandering-monster Aug 07 '22

God-brain is a dangerous mental disease.

Their world view is that Earth was created by a magic man who murdered everyone on earth w by drowning them, because he didn't think they were good enough.

A dude who needed his own son to be tortured and killed before he was willing to show some "forgiveness" to people for breaking arbitrary rules he made up.

And he's supposed to be the good guy. They literally worship him.

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u/Loive Aug 07 '22

They are taught from a young age that their god is the only possible source of morality, so they just can’t fathom how anyone could have morals without that god. That is also why many of them hate atheists so much, because they think atheists can do any horrible thing due to the inherent lack or morality.

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u/ilikelists789 Aug 07 '22

They have to think this way. Accepting that people could be moral without God would invalidate their whole belief system.

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u/Do_lay_low_mho Aug 07 '22

There’s a fantastic back and forth similar to this in Ricky Gervais’ Afterlife.

“If you don’t believe in god, why don’t you go around raping and murdering as much as you want??”

“I do go around raping and murdering as much as I want!” (Horrified faces), “which is none!”

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u/[deleted] Aug 07 '22

I love this show

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u/ihatetheheadlines Aug 07 '22

Have they never heard of the catholic church sex abuse scandel?

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u/Mr_Cyplixo Aug 07 '22 Silver

Which one?

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u/The_Vag_Badger Aug 07 '22

All of them

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u/ObscureDucks Aug 07 '22

Let's see, if I start working now I could get a list together by September 8th give or take a couple days

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u/The_Vag_Badger Aug 07 '22

Better get a move on then, time’s a-ticking

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u/Artor50 Aug 07 '22

And the SBC "Crisis of Faith," and just recently, the Mormon Church abuse report. They couldn't let the Catholics hog all the abuse.

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u/WarWonderful593 Aug 07 '22

Don't forget the Jehovah's Witnesses

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u/tamaleA19 Aug 07 '22

Or what the crusaders did? Or the inquisition? Or the genocide in Latin America? Or Canadian residential schools? Those are just what came to mind in the first 5 seconds I thought of it

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u/nana_banana2 Aug 07 '22

Christians: Unlike us, atheists have nothing stopping them from raping children.

Atheist: gestures broadly at Vatican

Christians: No, not like that.

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u/Jacks_Flaps Aug 07 '22

Also gestures broadly at the baptists, Anglicans, amish, Mormons, JWs...and every single christian sect on the planet.

Their claim to have god given objective morals has done fuck all to stop 2000 years of christian biblical slavery, genocide, rape, subjugation of women, slaughter of non believers and diddling of kids.

What's more their morality is by definition purely subjective and relative as it is dependent on a subject.. ie their version of their gods, and has changed constantly from era to era and christian to christian as per their own interpretation of the bible and personal preferences. And I say "their version" as no two christians can agree on what morals are objective or even the definition of their god. Hence we have over 40000 christian sects who cant agree on their core dogma let alone their morals.

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u/whatdayisitnow Aug 07 '22 edited Aug 07 '22

can't be governments cause governments have different laws

So it must be god since there's obviously only one religion /s

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u/montanagrizfan Aug 07 '22

This doesn’t even make sense in their own argument because every government has the same basic laws like don’t murder or steal. The rest are just things to keep society running smoothly like traffic laws or are based on Religious bs like not selling alcohol on Sunday or forcing women to cover their head.

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u/teawreckshero Aug 08 '22

"And then God said unto Abraham, thou shalt zipper merge with thy neighbor when converging unto a single lane."

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u/EliteSnackist Aug 07 '22

You could have this take if you ascribe yourself to the idea of "Nature" or "Nature's God", which is just the general sense of morality that most people believe in. In that sense, government doesn't determine morality, but mankind's natural sense of right and wrong does.

Granted, this isn't how that is being presented, but I think the example works when you view it in that way.

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u/p3x239 Aug 07 '22 Silver

Translation: I am a complete psychopath who only doesn't do monstrous things because I'm afraid of my imaginary friend.

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u/wholesomechunk Aug 07 '22

Sounds like, ‘Wish Jesus let me fuck kids’ type of person

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u/p3x239 Aug 07 '22

Aye, weird way to tell on yourself but then again these religious types were never very good at thinking things through. Otherwise they wouldn't be religious.

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u/PathComplex Aug 07 '22

But, if I do indulge in monstrous things, I confess and all is forgiven. So things really are going to be okay.

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u/Virel_360 Aug 07 '22 Gold

If you’re only a good person because you fear hell, you’re not really a good person.

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u/Zutroy2117 Aug 07 '22

Hit the nail right on the head.

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u/traumablades Aug 07 '22 edited Aug 07 '22

My darkest desire is drinking, smoking weed, and eating food that's bad for me.

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u/Friendofthegarden Aug 07 '22

and eating food that's bad for me.

I ate half a pound of bacon last night. It was fucking delicious and I strongly regret it.

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u/traumablades Aug 07 '22

That's the darkness in the desire

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u/wicawo Aug 07 '22

me too. aint botherin nobody

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u/DeathRaeGun Aug 07 '22

Probably because I don't actually want to do any of those things.

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u/vaxchoice Aug 07 '22

As an atheist I DO indulge all my darkest desires. I rape and kill exactly as often as I wish to.

None so far.

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u/Tsundoku_8 Aug 07 '22

Same here. I've always indulged in my darkest desires.

He'll, just the other day I smashed a dozen double chocolate fudge cupcakes in less than an hour and I'd gladly do it again.

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u/the_cat_who_shatner Aug 07 '22

This one time, I ate an entire cheesecake by myself and then took a nap.

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u/Tsundoku_8 Aug 07 '22

Sounds like a good time.

Damn, now I want cheesecake. The woes of a sweet tooth...

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u/Gamesman001 Aug 07 '22 edited Aug 07 '22

Everytime I make a pan of brownies or batch of chocolate chip cookies I eat half of them before the night is over. I often play games past 12am and I procrastinate on things I should/need to do. Those are sins right?

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u/mj1814 Aug 07 '22

Love the "so far" caveat.

Gotta CYA at all times. 😂

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u/RascalRibs Aug 07 '22

Imagine only doing good things because you're scared of some invisible man in the sky lol

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u/qwsedd Aug 07 '22

This is why they wont go to heaven if it exist. Because they do it out of cowardice. Not because they want to. As if an all knowing, all mighty creator cant see through basic shit like that

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u/Rude-Pangolin-1736 Aug 07 '22

Romans 2:6-8

He will render to each one according to his works: to those who by patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and immortality, he will give eternal life; but for those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, there will be wrath and fury.

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u/Vallcry Aug 07 '22

Well I'm fucked I guess.

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u/meatmechdriver Aug 07 '22

This is the thing that always gets me with religious assholes. They would have you believe their god is all knowing and all powerful but that they themselves are just a little bit more clever than he is and that’s how he doesn’t see through their bullshit.

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u/Thelonghiestman0409 Aug 07 '22

It’s funny because only rarely people are Christians because they actually want to help and save people and are not to forcefully. Those ones are the better ones than most in my experience of meeting those ones. Most just do it because they fear hell or no afterlife.

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u/Stormlightboi Aug 07 '22

The real questions we should all be asking is why there is a massive sphere in the sky that we can't make direct eye-contact with? Idk... seems kinda sketchy to me. ;)

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u/ImprovementReady4791 Aug 07 '22

PRAISE the SUN!

no wait-

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u/Zealousideal-Bus-346 Aug 07 '22

I just don't have the time to be immoral. Too busy looking for the objective basis of morality.

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u/Nitackit Aug 07 '22 Wholesome

American Christian’s have to invent excuses and reasoning to justify believing in fairy tales. No one wants to admit that they’ve been duped into the greatest scam in human history.

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u/MWleFylde Aug 07 '22

I don't need an imaginary sky daddy to tell me not to be a dick.

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u/shylock2k202 Aug 07 '22

Here’s the thing; if you need a book to tell you how to be a good person, chances are, you’re not a good person.

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u/Hiccup-92 Aug 07 '22

Surprisingly, my elders told me what is "right" and "wrong" I didn't know religion until I was mid teens, so does that mean I would automatically be more evil since there was no god? I don't believe in god now, and I treat most people way better than they'd treat me

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u/mamestrez Aug 07 '22

I brought up my children to always be kind, charitable and respectful not to gain a reward or praise but because it's just the right thing to do. They have become loving. Caring, kind, adults. I am so proud of them.

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u/Practical-Jelly-5320 Aug 07 '22

I really think these people don't understand empathy

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u/[deleted] Aug 07 '22

Which is sad, because Jesus was all about empathy.

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u/Illustrious_Leader93 Aug 07 '22

Such willful ignorance.

  1. Believing that a mythical sky fairy gave you your laws, isn't logic.

  2. Morality does not require a diety.

  3. Countries laws are all different (in specifics mostly) but so are religious admonitions and guidelines. I came from 2 very religious families. They both believe the other side is going to hell. Ever heard of Northern Ireland?

  4. Morality to gain access to heaven, isn't morality. Its a cost-benefit analysis.

  5. The atheist behaves morally because that's the person they want to be in the world....the religious are moral to get a prize.

  6. The atheist is a grown up, deciding what morality actually looks like and behaving accordingly. The theist needs an absent parent figure to attempt to please & to tell them what is right and wrong.

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u/mamestrez Aug 07 '22

OMG #5 nails it

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u/MFLuder1 Aug 07 '22

This clip from True Detective is perfect for this kind of thoughts.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_RfUj09pWfM

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u/TopAcanthocephala869 Aug 07 '22

Came here to post exactly this. “If the only thing keeping a person decent is the expectation of divine reward then, brother, that person is a piece of shit.”

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u/occamsrzor Aug 07 '22

Bachmanian Confession; the person asking the question is admitting the only thing preventing them from giving in to theirs is the wrath of an all powerful being.

I would not want that person anywhere near me or my family.

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u/GirlCowBev Aug 07 '22

In the words of Penn Jillette, “I already do all the raping and murdering I want to. And that is none. I don’t need a bunch of tribal nomads from 2000 years ago telling me how to treat my fellow human being.“

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u/W4r6060 Aug 07 '22

If the only thing stopping you from raping people is an imaginary old man, you need some serious help.

Or a prison cell.

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u/pizzamike64 Aug 07 '22

What's to stop believers from doing bad shit? Jesus died to pay for their sins. So they get a free pass to heaven no matter what, right? Turn the narrative around on them.

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u/Lystrade Aug 07 '22

I do all of the reprehensible acts that theists think I do to my heart's content. The amount that I want to do those things is zero. If you need to have the threat of burning for eternity to deter you from doing unspeakable evil, I think that says more about you than it does me.

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u/Oahkery Aug 07 '22

I'm confused about the point here. Didn't this person just defeat their own argument? They say that God creates morals, but also that atheists, who don't believe in God, don't just ruin amok doing all sorts of evil things on a whim. So which is it? And they say atheists need to respond to that argument? How? They gave the response already: we atheists have morals even without God.

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u/hatechicken82 Aug 07 '22

Yes. Exactly this.

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u/Headworx66 Aug 07 '22

I kind of look at it the other way.... If people only do good deeds because they are scared of their God or to get into heaven, then that's selfish so they should inherently go to the warm place.

It's ironic that the atheists that are good people just because they believe it's right are the ones that should qualify to go to some sky fairies promised land.

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u/Artor50 Aug 07 '22

I know a lot of Christians who are kind, decent people. Most of my family, for an example. But they are kind and decent in spite of their religion, not at all because of it.

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u/b_a_t_m_4_n Aug 07 '22

in spite of their religion

Nailed it.

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u/OminaeYu81 Aug 07 '22

Most atheists have a higher standard for morals than most religious people. Mostly due to education. I'm not trying to bash anyone here.

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u/montanagrizfan Aug 07 '22

The more educated you are the more of the world you become aware of and the more you realize that being a decent human is the key to a successful and rewarding life. I also feel that those who are narrow minded and unwilling to escape their own views are the ones who refuse higher education. They don’t want to expand their world because it would force them to come to term with the fact their own beliefs are wrong.

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u/Cabernet2H2O Aug 07 '22

This thinking really scares me and I really hope people like this person never lose their faith. Because if some god is the only thing that keeps someone from committing the most heinous acts they're some sick individuals that probably should already be under some form of care.

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u/SpeakingNight Aug 07 '22 edited Aug 07 '22

I consider myself pretty atheist or agnostic, I don't live religion or spirituality in any way.

Believe it or not, we still care about the world and any suffering in it, so two major rules still apply even without religion:

1) treat others how you want to be treated

2) if everyone behaved like you, would the world be better for it or worse off? Live accordingly.

That's just morality everyone should have as a human.

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u/roc_10009 Aug 07 '22

The golden rule, as my grandmother taught us. No deity needed.

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u/Hard-tat Aug 07 '22

If you need the threat of eternal damnation to be a good person, you’re not a good person

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u/YeetThePig Aug 07 '22

If you need the threat of divine punishment to stop yourself from being a monster, that speaks to a defect in your character, not mine.

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u/Sp1ffy_Sp1ff Aug 07 '22

If the only reason you're a good person is because you're scared God will punish you, then you're not a good person